I'm Thinking of Making a Tier List (Topic 2, Deoxies S).

The fist thing we should discuss is how many tiers will we have? (most sites
have 5, however I'd personally like to go for 6 or 7).

Once we have the number of tiers we will name them (we can use the
standard or our own, if we have more than 5 we will need to name some).

Once we have the tiers set up most pokemon will fall in to place, the ones
that don't will be discussed in this topic as well as any changes to the list
after it is made.


If you help with this you'll be credited.

History:
Deoxies-S, OU.

i agree with fan here, people may get confused when battling here cuz there are only five tiers everywhere

just stick with five is say

Standared it is, though I may make sub-tiers (ie upper-lower, high-mid-low etc).

Next topic:
Deoxies-S, Uber, OU or Borderline.
This isn't a simple matter of oppinion, please give a reason as to why it should be
in the rank you choose.

deo-s is borderline in my opinion. Simply based on the fact that he's not over used. The bigwigs at smogon kicked him out of the uber ties because he's so vanilla, despite his broad moveset. I've only seen a few deo-s in my time as a battler, and it really isn't useful enough to be considered OU in my opinion.

Latiosmaster47 wrote:deo-s is borderline in my opinion. Simply based on the fact that he's not over used. The bigwigs at smogon kicked him out of the uber ties because he's so vanilla, despite his broad moveset. I've only seen a few deo-s in my time as a battler, and it really isn't useful enough to be considered OU in my opinion.

You have to remember that Pokemon aren't tiered according to their level of usage only. They gain their tier because of strength. I mean, there's plenty of Pokemon in the OU tier that you don't see every day. Being in the OU tier simply means they have the potential to be overused. I think that with his great moveset and amazing speed(although mediocre in all others, except for it's horrible Base 50 HP) he should at least be OU until he gets a little more testing. Personally, I've seen a great uprising of Deoxys-S ever since he was pronounced a probationary OU. I haven't personally used him myself much, but I've battled plenty. They're not very hard to counter in OU, but are too strong to be BL, so I think it should stay there.

hellrider000 wrote:You have to remember that Pokemon aren't tiered according to their level of usage only.

That's exactly the reason why I mentioned his mediocre stats and lukewarm potential. Yes, yes he has a wide base of moves to choose from, but due to his mediocre def/sp. def, he gets 2HKOed by most everything. The only real use I've seen for deo-s is as a support pokemon, and personally, I see forretress and donphan as much better supports.

It's my opinion, the status of deo-s is up for debate but my opinion is not.

Latiosmaster47 wrote:Yes, yes he has a wide base of moves to choose from, but due to his mediocre def/sp. def, he gets 2HKOed by most everything.

Well, that's if he doesn't KO them 1st considering he outspeeds all of the OU metagame, if they are't boosted. (Agility, Choice Scarf, etc.)

Latiosmaster47 wrote: The only real use I've seen for deo-s is as a support pokemon, and personally, I see forretress and donphan as much better supports.

Well, Deoxys-S is a different kind of supporter than them. Those two are mainly Spikers/SR, while Deoxys can also do those things, he has a lot more to choose from than them, and some of it he can put to better use considering he's faster.

Latiosmaster47 wrote:It's my opinion, the status of deo-s is up for debate but my opinion is not.

I am debating about it's status. I'm debating against you because you have a different opinion(and you're then only other person posting ), not trying to change your opinion.

fair enough. It looks like deo needs more testing anyway. I don't think Deo-s would win in a support battle between some of the more proven supporters. Anything with a first-attacking move (azumarril, donphan, etc.) gets an easy win over deo-s as well because it essentially neutralizes his speed bonus.

he outspeeds everything in the everything play btw <_< but his speed means nothing against a poke like donphan.

I think Deoxys-S can pretty fairly stand up to Donphan's Ice Shard.

Timid Deoxys with 252 Sp. Atk EVs does w\ Ice Beam 66-78% to a 252 HP EV Donphan. A definite 2HKO.

In return, Adamant Donphan with 252 Atk EVs only does 19-22% to Deoxys-S with Ice Shard, and does 70-82% with EQ. So it's a possible 2HKO, if the Deoxys doesn't have Leftovers, which is standard on the EV set I used, which is the standard supporter.

Choice Band 252 Atk EV Azumarill does 49-58% to Deoxys with Aqua Jet.
While the same Deoxys above only does 19-22% with Superpower in return.

So it looks like CB Azumarill can beat Deoxys-S 1 on 1, which is yet another reason why I think he should stay in OU instead of Ubers.

I forgot to factor in items like Leftovers, so these might not turn out exactly like those numbers show.

I would do Foretress and a whole bunch of other OU Pokes, and maybe some ubers, but I'm too lazy.

Calculations done on the Metal Kid Damage Calculator

Is anybody else ever gonna post.

hellrider000 wrote:Timid Deoxys with 252 Sp. Atk EVs does 66-78% to a 252 HP EV Donphan.

what attack is deoxys using?

the way to take him out isn't consecutive ice shards anyway, it's some harder hitting attack first (I.E. earthquake) then a quick hit from ice shard to knock out deo before he has a chance to respond.

That's the point I was trying to get across anyway.

Latiosmaster47 wrote:

hellrider000 wrote:Timid Deoxys with 252 Sp. Atk EVs does 66-78% to a 252 HP EV Donphan.

what attack is deoxys using?

the way to take him out isn't consecutive ice shards anyway, it's some harder hitting attack first (I.E. earthquake) then a quick hit from ice shard to knock out deo before he has a chance to respond.

That's the point I was trying to get across anyway.

Yeah, I thought about that scenario as soon as I posted that so I went back and did the EQ calcs, and also fixed up the post a little more, including making sure all the attacks were there.

So, just check my last post.